Speech inversion scrambling - popular radios

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Speech inversion scrambling - popular radios

Postby G4RMT » Tue May 23, 2017 5:39 pm

Odd question - we speak loads on here about budget radios, but do any have the old fashioned speech inversion scrambling on them. I've had a client who is using PMR446 and says he has this, and on listening to his people this afternoon - from a distance - they are using it. I have some cheaper ken woods (non-PMR446) but the function, that I've never used, doesn't actually seem to function. I suspect these radios could be counterfeits, but that's something else. Any Baofengs, TYT or other cheaper brands that still have this. When I get back, I'll have to go through all the programmers to see if anything I have in stock does it - but if anyone can save me some time with a steer - that would be great.
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Re: Speech inversion scrambling - popular radios

Postby thelad » Tue May 23, 2017 10:19 pm

Yep the BF888s have it, i use mine on PMR446 with it set on.
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Re: Speech inversion scrambling - popular radios

Postby G4RMT » Wed May 24, 2017 11:29 am

You're joking! Never thought to even try those. Thanks for that, I don't need to go further with a pile on the shelf in the store still in boxes!
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Re: Speech inversion scrambling - popular radios

Postby m0lsx » Wed May 24, 2017 12:26 pm

thelad wrote:Yep the BF888s have it, i use mine on PMR446 with it set on.


That is beat shift not scrambling. Beat shift for those who do not understand it moves the oscillator frequency to avoid you experiencing internally generated interference on a desired frequency & this does distort the audio as a side effect of that shift, but it is not a scrambler.
The last people I remember using speech inversion were the Police prior to Aiwave. It is why I brought my Alinco DJ-X3.
I have been told it was not speech inversion & that I would not have been able to resolve it, but I have heard radio traffic during several stake outs here in Norwich, plus other bits & although the audio was never as clear as on FM, it was on a par with SSB & perfectly readable.
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Re: Speech inversion scrambling - popular radios

Postby thelad » Wed May 24, 2017 12:29 pm

Ah yes you are right. i stand corrected. :biggrin:
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Re: Speech inversion scrambling - popular radios

Postby G4RMT » Wed May 24, 2017 1:40 pm

Not having much luck, in that I've discovered it's also on some of the Kenwoods (real ones - the counterfeits do not do anthing) but between brands the results are variable in the ability to turn it back into real speech.
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Re: Speech inversion scrambling - popular radios

Postby m0lsx » Wed May 24, 2017 2:21 pm

G4RMT wrote:Not having much luck, in that I've discovered it's also on some of the Kenwoods (real ones - the counterfeits do not do anthing) but between brands the results are variable in the ability to turn it back into real speech.


Some of the old Kenwoods also had Beat Shift.
Googling Beat Shift Kenwood, I find, TK-2170 & 3170. TM-27, TH-K40A, TK-350 & a few others. Also the Retevis H-777, which is a Kenwood copy.
So maybe some have been using it as scrambling, or are being mis-sold Beat Shift as scrambling. Which if the listener looks no further it is. But it is hardly safe, as there is no decoding to do, just another radio with Beat Shift needed.
As far as 446 or us other casual users are concerned, for example the recent post about 446. Then Beat Shift would probably suffice & give us what is required & at a decent price.
But it's not inversion.
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Re: Speech inversion scrambling - popular radios

Postby Metradio » Wed May 24, 2017 2:34 pm

thelad wrote:Yep the BF888s have it, i use mine on PMR446 with it set on.


Not all 888s have speech inversion, some do some don't... Externally there is no difference, no marking and nothing on the boxes.
No good asking dealers unless they unbox them, reprogram and try them out.
Even programming will not tell you if it has speech inversion, the only way is to program them up and try on another radio to see if the speech is inverted...

Most modern radio scanners have some form of Close Call, which will find and receive your transmissions within seconds..

Best way of preventing the enemy overhearing your important messages is to use coded phrases - you make your own up, or all learn to speak Navajo :smiles:

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Re: Speech inversion scrambling - popular radios

Postby thelad » Wed May 24, 2017 3:40 pm

All my BF888s have it and i have one BF888 without, i asumed the S stood for it and the BF888 was just standard.
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Re: Speech inversion scrambling - popular radios

Postby Metradio » Wed May 24, 2017 6:07 pm

thelad wrote:All my BF888s have it and i have one BF888 without, i asumed the S stood for it and the BF888 was just standard.

From: http://www.miklor.com/BF888/

"Scrambler / Speech Inverter (not available on some BF888S)

1. This option activates Voice Inversion.
2. When set, radios will no longer TX/RX normal audio on the selected channel.
3. All radios in the group must have the option set on the same channel to function properly between radios.

Note: There are 3 known stickers on the inner case.
Blue "K", White "B" and Green "UPDATE".
It has been reported that radios with "UPDATE" and "B" stickers have the scrambler option, and the "K" does not.
Baofeng, however, says the sticker does not do not determine whether your radio has this option."

I did some of the research for the above page on what 888's have Voice Inversion..

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